Hints and Tips Thread

[Rogo]

Hey guys,

Heres a thread for general hints and advice for artists that other might find useful. Don't think any things you'd picked up are useless and if you think we might get a kick out of em, let us know!

[Devil]

Hmm...So many tips I could give.

I guess instead of boring peeps, I'll say some stuff I learned.

Time - Huzzah! Why time? Well, this sort of fits in with practice/experience. No one, weather they read books on anatomy, studied anime, or famous artist's work, is ever going to be a pro their first time drawing. I find people who want to become artists don't realize how much practice and time it actually takes. When they don't see results in their drawings, they give up. From what I learn over the course of several years is that your drawing style will get better as you draw. So peeps, don't stop drawing! ;D

*cough* Anyways...

Inspiration - So, now that you know you need practice and devote time into it, now on to some inspiration. After all, how are you going to draw if you have no clue where to start? Some beginner artists should look at what they really like in art. Weather it's famous artists, Manga, Anime, American comics like Batman and Superman, Cartoons, fellow peeps on the internet who draw(*cough* Rogo); anything really to get your inspiration flowing. If you like those styles, add bits a pieces here and there to your own artwork.

Okay...enough of that...I'm probably boring people...QQ

Last thing!

Sketches - We need order in those drawings now! Sketching first before you draw is a great way to plan how it will look in the end. I recommend looking on youtube for different sketching methods, because there is soooo many of them. You will find your art will really improve if you sketch.

Anyways, hope this help any inspiring artists~ Probably was boring or non-useful. Q_Q I tried~ =D

[Rogo]

Okay first tip I can give is this - don't get into a habit of copying other art styles.

Yes I am a massive hypocrite for saying this considering MY art style but I guess this is me saying you should learn from my mistakes. It's very easy to get locked into a certain art style and very hard to get out of that style.

For example, if you draw in a very heavily stereotypical manga style, what happens when you need to draw over-weight or over-muscular characters? What happens if you want to draw an old character? If you've locked yourself into drawing pretty boys and girls, you are going to struggle like HELL to draw these people.

Why yes I DO speak from experience and it's something that bugs me about my own character designs sometimes.

Another good tip I can give is to be experimental and try new things. Have an idea for something you think might look cool? Get it down on paper and show it to some people (maybe start a thread here) and then get feedback. Gravston has a LOT of that going on - especially in early chapters - and as a result of feedback my art work has improved... I hope.

Basically what this boils down to is constantly challenge yourself. Devise interesting angles, come up with characters that don't fit your comfort zone and just try new things. That's how you grow as an artist.

[Pumpkinhead]

Devil: I didn't think it was boring, you gave good advice It's true, a lot of it is effort and practice. Even if someone is "naturally talented", it doesn't do them any good if they don't put in any effort to hone their skills.

Something that specifically helped me get better was to take official artwork of video-game characters (like Sonic or Link) and try to draw them as close to the original artwork as possible. Earlier on it was a slow, tedious, and frustrating process that required a ton of erasing in order to get my drawing to look right (and even then something would usually be off...proportions wouldn't look quite right, the characters eyes would be slightly farther apart than they did in the original, etc.). But I made a habit out of doing this every day, and eventually it showed results. Not only could I draw an accurate copy of something by looking at it, but I got faster at drawing, my line work improved overall, and it was easier for me to redraw my own characters consistently because I had a ton of practice engaging in that sort of activity with other people's characters. And it feels much more rewarding than tracing XD

Drawing takes a lot of work if you want to get good, an it can feel discouraging when your art won't turn out the way you want it to at first. BUT NEVER GIVE UP! With enough passion, patience, and persistence, you can make it. Believe in yourself and you will persevere.

[Rogo]

Feb 11, 2012 14:04:37 GMT -5 Pumpkinhead said:

I didn't think it was boring, you gave good advice darkdeathdevil! It's true, a lot of it is effort and practice. Even if someone is "naturally talented", it doesn't do them any good if they don't put in any effort to hone their skills.

Something that specifically helped me get better was to take official artwork of video-game characters (like Sonic or Link) and try to draw them as close to the original artwork as possible. Earlier on it was a slow, tedious, and frustrating process that required a ton of erasing in order to get my drawing to look right (and even then something would usually be off...proportions wouldn't look quite right, the characters eyes would be slightly farther apart than they did in the original, etc.). But I made a habit out of doing this every day, and eventually it showed results. Not only could I draw an accurate copy of something by looking at it, but I got faster at drawing, my line work improved overall, and it was easier for me to redraw my own characters consistently because I had a ton of practice engaging in that sort of activity with other people's characters. And it feels much more rewarding than tracing XD

Drawing takes a lot of work if you want to get good, an it can feel discouraging when your art won't turn out the way you want it to at first. BUT NEVER GIVE UP! With enough passion, patience, and persistence, you can make it. Believe in yourself and you will persevere.

First off, I think 'naturally talented' people can end off very lazy.

Secondly, while I know everyone does what you said, I do have to heavily emphasise that if you do that too much you can end up trapped in a certain style that's not your own. You'll get a lot better if you do life drawing. XD

[Pumpkinhead]

Feb 11, 2012 14:07:30 GMT -5 Rogo said:

Feb 11, 2012 14:04:37 GMT -5 Pumpkinhead said:

I didn't think it was boring, you gave good advice darkdeathdevil! It's true, a lot of it is effort and practice. Even if someone is "naturally talented", it doesn't do them any good if they don't put in any effort to hone their skills.

Something that specifically helped me get better was to take official artwork of video-game characters (like Sonic or Link) and try to draw them as close to the original artwork as possible. Earlier on it was a slow, tedious, and frustrating process that required a ton of erasing in order to get my drawing to look right (and even then something would usually be off...proportions wouldn't look quite right, the characters eyes would be slightly farther apart than they did in the original, etc.). But I made a habit out of doing this every day, and eventually it showed results. Not only could I draw an accurate copy of something by looking at it, but I got faster at drawing, my line work improved overall, and it was easier for me to redraw my own characters consistently because I had a ton of practice engaging in that sort of activity with other people's characters. And it feels much more rewarding than tracing XD

Drawing takes a lot of work if you want to get good, an it can feel discouraging when your art won't turn out the way you want it to at first. BUT NEVER GIVE UP! With enough passion, patience, and persistence, you can make it. Believe in yourself and you will persevere.

Secondly, while I know everyone does what you said, I do have to heavily emphasise that if you do that too much you can end up trapped in a certain style that's not your own. You'll get a lot better if you do life drawing. XD

Um...The exercise of drawing something from observation was the point I was trying to make... I was just saying that the main way I did this as a kid was drawing my favorite characters, and I think that can be a good starting point. But I agree that you shouldn't only draw those characters, because you can become gridlocked. Beyond this exercise, I think it is important that you still develop your own style.

I also agree with what you said about experimenting with what you draw, and drawing a variety of things. Something I still have a problem with is drawing vehicles and architecture...I never liked drawing those things, they seemed boring and mundane and I preferred drawing characters, and worst of all they required vanishing points. But if I want to place those characters in a plausible environment then...I kinda have to, like it or not.

[Rogo]

Ah okay I misunderstood - no worries

Also I struggle with backgrounds (as you all know) so I try and push myself to draw more and more backgrounds these days. XD

[Devil]

My point too, Rogo. I didn't mean it that everyone should copy other people's art, I meant it's for them to get started. Some people can't draw their own style, because they haven't found their own style. I would NEVER copy off other people's art, but in order to find my art style, I had to look at others.

My tips were for noobies. XD

Anyways, yes, expeirmenting is good! I always challege myself. Drawing fat people or muscular people is one of my weak points(not so much muscular) and I do believe it's from being used to drawing manga style. However, I've got to the point where I am able to draw something from my head onto paper. Plus- now, every artist is different- but I don't usually make too many fat characters. It makes me an unrealistic artist, but I'm okay with that. ;D

[Rogo]

My tip was also for noobies XD

Seriously life drawing is the best starting point, but most people who draw started off with copying. So did I. Just saying it's a BAD habit to get into and to be aware of that XD

[Pumpkinhead]

This was a question that occurred to me after the discussion Feathers and I were having about angst in kids' shows (When Characters go "Emo" thread).

So say you have a story that you want to be "suitable" for kids, but edgy and/or dark enough that adults also enjoy watching it, or may possibly enjoy it even more than kids (examples that come to mind are The Secret of Nimh, the TV show Gargoyles, etc.). So my question is, do you think it is possible to have an angsty character because of a traumatic past without showing that past in flashbacks, and have it be effective? Say it's something that would be far too adult to show onscreen, like abuse or something, but you could imply it and get it across to the adults (since they would be old enough to pick up on something like that) while the kids don't pick up on what exactly it is until they're older, but they understand enough that something bad happened to that character. Is it possible to pull that off, or if it's too adult to show onscreen, should you just leave it out altogether? I hope I'm making sense here XD

[Rogo]

I believe you can pull it off but it takes a lot of talent.

The best thing to do is imply these sort of things. The number of kids cartoons with horrible implications is staggering. Best examples are disney movies for a start.

Worst thing to do is skirt around things like that or worse, go full on preachy. I remember an episode of Static Shock about a kid bringing a gun to school that was awful, but an episode about racism that was a bit better because it was more natural.

Keep it real, keep it tasteful and you can get away with it.

[Feathers]

OMG I didn't know this thread could be used for writing tips too! LOL Well if that's so then I've been having a real debate in my mind. I tried to ask my sister, but she wasn't sure what to do either. Anyway, I'm writing a Soul Eater FanFic at the moment and since I love writing tragic endings I'd like to have one of the character die. It's actually an OC so no worries there with OOCness or anything. LOL

However, I'm not quite sure how to pull it off. I was hoping people here could give me some examples or guidelines to follow so the end doesn't bring the whole story down. Thanks in advance~ <3

[Pumpkinhead]

@rogo: LOL! I remember that episode! XD I remember this commercial that showed all week before it aired too, and the narrator in it was going on about how that bullied kid was going to "unleash the worst kind of weapon that would change everyone’s lives” or something dramatic like that, and I remember I was like “Pfff, it’ll probably just turn out to be a gun or something”. Then when it was, I was like “ARE YOU FREAKING SERIOUS?!”

Yeah and then Static’s “Remember kids, don’t you EVER touch a gun!” preach at the end XD Lol that's definitely the route that should be avoided at all costs if you want to be taken seriously XD The Gargoyles episode "Deadly Force" is a MUCH better example of a "gun episode" done well.

But yeah...in a kid's show it can be really tricky to imply something dark and adult...yet not disturb children too much. And yet also give it enough emotional punch that it has reason to be there in the first place. That's why I wasn't sure if you could pull off a character with a traumatic past without flashbacks and without it coming off as a Sasuke or something. But in a kid's show, leaving something to the imagination might be more powerful than showing them anyway. Thanks for the advice!

@feathers: Hm...well, maybe the character could die in a heroic sacrifice? Those can be tragic, but dying to save someone's life/save the world/etc. would be sad, but also noble, so it could give it more of a bittersweet sort of ending to your story instead of feeling like a complete downer (if that's what you meant by "bring the whole story down"). That said, if you want some tragedy then there should probably be some build up for that character's death; so they should definitely have some kind of plot significance, and give your audience a genuine reason to have an emotional attachment to that character and to sympathize with them. If you go the heroic sacrifice route, it could be the way the character redeems her/himself for making a horrible mistake earlier in the plot or for being on bad terms with the other characters or something, which would also add poignancy to the act.

I think most importantly, whatever way you choose to go, don't be too formulaic, because then your audience might pick up on it and see it coming, and on the flip side it don't just have them just die suddenly at random. Then it just feels like you killed them off just for the sake of trying to make the story sad, which won't feel natural and genuine, so you won't get a genuinely sad response from your audience. I hope that's helpful.

[Rogo]

I personally think that when it comes to a tragic ending death, it's best to do it only if it's in character or the situation can only be solved by the death of the character. Killing off for killing off sake is lame and tired.

[Feathers]

@pumpkinhead

The way they die is not really self-sacrifice. More like, they did something good and end up accidently getting killed. That sort of thing. So while it is noble, it's not really self-sacrifice.

@rogo

Now by that do you mean that characters who deaths could have been prevented are lame? Because the character's death kind of could have been prevented if there were different circumstances. However, if you mean don't just kill off a character just to make everyone sad or just cuz you feel like it, then I don't plan on doing that, heh.


I have a bit of build up and hints. Like the character has one flaw that they is often brought up and eventually because they don't overcome this flaw, it causes their death. That's how I have it set up. Now I realize this flaw might be a bad thing, and so not to give away any spoilers(someone on these forums says they want to read it when I'm done), do you mind giving me examples of good/bad flaws that can lead to character death? Thanks again in advance!